Jesus & Therapy: Breaking Stigma, Finding Healing - Tabitha Yates

In this powerful episode, we sit down with Tabitha Yates, a survivor whose journey through trauma, mental illness, and faith has shaped a calling to speak truth and bring hope to others. Tabitha grew up in a home marked by abuse, carrying the weight of depression, anxiety, PTSD, self-harm, and even a suicide attempt into adulthood. For years, she believed her struggles were signs of weak faith—a message reinforced by the church that left her feeling abandoned in her darkest season.

But Tabitha’s story didn’t end there. Through therapy and a renewed relationship with Jesus, she discovered that mental illness is not a spiritual failure, but part of the healing journey God can redeem. Today, she shares openly about breaking stigma, confronting trauma, and finding freedom in both faith and professional help.

Join us as Tabitha unpacks her journey and the message behind her book Jesus and Therapy—an honest invitation to anyone wrestling with their faith and mental health to know they are not alone, healing is possible, and Jesus walks with us every step of the way.

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Transcript

Israel Caminero: 0:04

Thank you so much for tuning in to today's episode. I'm grateful for your support and for being part of this community. If you've been enjoying the podcast so far, I'd love it if you could take a minute to leave a review. Your feedback helps me reach more people and share these inspiring stories with others. Let's spread the word. Please share this podcast with your friends and family. And if you haven't already, be sure to like and subscribe for new episodes. To stay connected and up to date on all the latest news, updates, and exclusive content, head over to my Facebook page, Living Testimonies. While you're there, be sure to subscribe to my newsletter. The link is on the page. Thanks again for listening, and I'll catch you in the next episode. Welcome to Living Testimony Stories of Faith and Redemption. I'm your host, Israel Caminero, and I hope that everyone that's listening today is blessed and doing well. With me today, I have my sister in Christ. Her name is Tabitha Yates. Can you say a little bit about yourself, Tabitha, to everyone?

Tabitha Yates: 1:28

My name is Tabitha. I live in Southern Arizona. I am the author of Jesus and Therapy, Bridging the Gap Between Faith and Mental Health. I'm a writer and an editor and a mental health advocate. I have three kiddos that I homeschool all of them here in Arizona, and I deeply wish I lived somewhere without rattlesnakes and cactus.

Israel Caminero: 1:50

Homeschooling. My wife just started homeschooling our two kids this year for the first time. Well, not for the first time, but they were going to school and they decided they wanted to get homeschooled, so we'll see how that venture goes.

Tabitha Yates: 2:03

It is an adventure for sure.

Israel Caminero: 2:06

Indeed. I'm glad I'll be at work while she's doing that. Um so she's here to share her testimony, as always, and before she does it, I'd like to just pray over us and say, Father God, we come before you today with grateful hearts. Thank you for giving us this platform where testimonies of your goodness and healing can be shared. Lord, we ask that you bless this conversation, that every word spoken would point back to you. May this testimony bring comfort to the hurting, strength to the weary, and hope to those who feel alone. Holy Spirit lead us and let everything said today glorify the name of Jesus. Amen. So Tabitha, thank you for being here again. I know your story will encourage many who are listening. Let's start with your journey and what brought you to where you are today. Can you share a little about your background and challenges you faced growing up?

Tabitha Yates: 3:00

Yes, absolutely. So I was raised in a half-Christian home. Um, my mother was a believer, my father was not. So I was led to Christ when I was three years old, but it definitely did not uh save me from a life of trauma, unfortunately. My dad was very physically, emotionally, mentally, verbally abusive. Um, so by the time I was, you know, not even six months old, I'd be I had been beaten to unconsciousness. I was regularly, you know, being wounded. And it was a very rocky start to where I really don't even remember. There's not a time I can look back and remember in my childhood that was not very difficult. And so my parents um ended up getting a divorce when I was seven. We moved around a lot in the military, and so by that point I was already suffering from, you know, the beginning stages of a lot of mental health issues just because of, again, you know, such complex trauma going on continually. Um, when my dad left, my mom decided to kind of immerse us in a really uh legalistic, unhealthy church and let all those men kind of take the spot of my dad. So I ended up being abused by my pastor, my elder, by visiting men in the church, and just suffering from a lot of spiritual and church abuse as well. And so I was just kind of immersed in this um Christian background, but really with a Jesus that was being shown to me that was not at all who Jesus really is.

Israel Caminero: 4:41

Wow. So you said you were getting abused by the pastor and other men in the church?

Tabitha Yates: 4:50

Yeah, there was um some really severe verbal abuse going on and a lot of spiritual abuse, a lot of gaslighting, um, a lot of um, it's just a very, very unhealthy environment um where women and children were incredibly devalued. And um when I started really falling into a depression, and I came to church leaders and and told them, um, I was told everything from, you know, it's my sin. Again, I'm just a little child. God's um given up on me, he's washing his hands of me. I'm beyond reaching and not worth saving. If I prayed more, I wouldn't have these problems. If I attempted suicide, I'd go to hell. And just it was a very, very dark place and no real support there, and no real representation of you know God's true heart towards me. It was just, you know, there was something really wrong with me, and it was all me, and none of the abuse I was experiencing was recognized as the source of obviously my budding depression. Um, and so it was just really just a very toxic environment where there was no awareness of of their actions, of you know, the actions of my parents and what that was doing to my mental health at that young age, and it was just um really, really just an unhealthy place to grow up.

Israel Caminero: 6:17

Sure sounds like it. I wouldn't want to be going to that church, I'll tell you that right now.

Tabitha Yates: 6:23

No.

Israel Caminero: 6:23

Um considering what you said, how did those struggles affect your faith and the way you saw God at that time?

Tabitha Yates: 6:31

Well, that is the hardest part because when it is, you know, foundational people in your life as a child, when it's your parents, when it's church leadership, what you just assume that their word is God's truth, you know, and you don't question it. And so those very that very much became my beliefs about God and about myself. I just formed these core beliefs. Um I'm too much for God, He doesn't love me, there's not enough grace for me, I've gone too far, He wants to wash His hands of me. Um, I I'm too messed up to ever come to Jesus. So, like everything that my home life taught me, you know, my the church kind of reinforced, and so I already felt like absolutely unable to come to Jesus, probably by the time I was 10, 12 years old. Just I it that was not available to me because I was so horrible in my mind.

Israel Caminero: 7:29

So, what was the turning point when you began to experience healing, you know, as far as knowing that that wasn't true discipleship or anything like that from the church?

Tabitha Yates: 7:41

Um, that took it took a it getting a lot, lot worse. Um, I got to the point when I was 14 and I was severely suicidal. And directly following a church service, I attempted suicide when I was um 15 years old. I overdosed and blacked out. Um, but I woke up the next day and it, you know, continued with self-harm, eventually culminating in me being locked in a psych ward when I was just 16 years old. And that was just an absolute rock bottom for me. But unfortunately, when you are a minor and you don't have autonomy, you can recognize the toxicity in the situation and you can't necessarily always escape it. So I was being forced to attend that church, even though I knew it was killing me and destroying any hope of me having a healthy relationship with Jesus. And I knew it wasn't an accurate represent representation of who God was and what his heart was to me. But by that point, when I was about 16 years old, I just completely left the faith. I refused to go to that church anymore. I said, I will go to a different church as long as I'm under your roof, but it's not going to be this one anymore. And so I, but really, I just completely detached because I could see no healthy path forward. I could, I could see no way that I could be a Christian. It just seemed incompatible with who I was and who they were telling me I was. And so it took it getting so, so, so much darker. And I remember when I finally got out of a psychiatric hospital driving home and just attempting to form a prayer because I've been refusing to talk to God for quite a while and just like, God, I'm gonna try one more time. And if you can do what you do and show me who you really are, I'm gonna give you a chance. And it was crazy because I was coming up over a hill when I was praying, and I came back down the hill, and there was a huge rainbow. And it was like I was literally telling God, I'm making you no promises, um, but he was making me one that he was gonna show up and he was gonna be faithful. And it ended up then just becoming this lifelong journey of healing, of unraveling, of recovering from church hurt, of a lot of counseling. That's why my book is uses in therapy, and so much of what I talk about is those two things working together for the most comprehensive healing because I couldn't do one without the other. There was so much brokenness and trauma, and um, I had to address it and I had to work really hard to get to the root of all those things and replace all those beliefs that had been formed about myself, the world around me, who God was, who I was, and I couldn't have a relationship with Jesus until I found out who he really was and how he really loved me and to where I walked through so much of that. So it's really from that on, that was like kind of the point that propelled me when I um got out of the psychiatric hospital. But then it was also motherhood that really solidified like, man, this is a lifelong journey. Because when I had my kids, you know, of course, it brings out a whole new side of you, and so many triggers and things that I saw still came up, and and I was like, I'm I'm not gonna pass this on to my kids. I'm gonna make sure that they have the most health, healthy, and whole parent that they can possibly have. So that sent me to even deeper healing and even more intensive therapy that I could just walk through as much trauma as I needed to, so that I could be as present and whole for them as possible. And so it's really not a short journey. It's been a long, lifelong thing of because again, it's your core beliefs, it's everything you built your life on and your beliefs about everything around you. And I had to just strip that back down to nothing and let God slowly whisper the truth to me and reveal it to me and be faithful to keep on showing it to me until I finally believed it. And so God has just been so faithful to walk with me through this kind of journey of brokenness to discovery of his heart for me and others, and that's just my passion now, you know, to help other people walk through that brokenness and walk through their mental health struggles and find out, you know, that maybe God isn't who you thought he was and who other people and Christians represented him to you as.

Israel Caminero: 12:02

That's true. I heard you mention that for a long time you believed mental health struggles meant meant weak faith. What shifted in you when you realized that that wasn't true?

Tabitha Yates: 12:17

That was just that was what I was always told. That was the misconception, and really is still, I think, one of the primary misconceptions that people have regarding believers who struggle with their mental health. But um, that that was one of the things that was really drilled in me that it was somehow a reflection of my belief in God. Like if I believed more, if I prayed more, if I trusted more, I wouldn't have these problems. And it's just simply not true because we live in a broken world and people have free will. And those people with free will were inflicting very significant harm on my being in every possible way. And so the brain is a part of the body and it can have inherent brokenness as well. But trauma creates brokenness that that not that God would ever want that for you, but it's a reality of living in this world that we have to walk through. And I was able to get to a point where I realized how deeply my church was spiritualizing mental health issues that made perfect sense given, you know, the fact that I'm being beaten to unconsciousness and attempting suicide and struggling with all these things, and no adults were helping me, and I wasn't allowed to go to therapy. Um, and my church, it was a very illegitimate thing. They they had no awareness of anything with mental health, they didn't recognize it. It was all faith to them, it was all lack of faith. And so that was so much of what I had to unravel and realize that it's not a moral flaw, that I wasn't in sin, that I wasn't doing something wrong because I was struggling with depression and anxiety and suicidality. I was a child who was being deeply abused and not getting the help I needed to walk through that. So of course I had issues.

Israel Caminero: 14:02

Wow. It's hard to believe that a church would just say that it was lack of faith. You know, instead of trying to shepherd and help you while you're going through things like this. So I mean, obviously, you're good with the church now, right?

Tabitha Yates: 14:18

Yeah, I took it took a lot of of healing and recovering, but I am an active church member now, and um I love the church, and that's why I'm willing to talk about the things we're missing the mark on, so that we can do better, so that we can love people better, so that we can, you know, um help and not harm people.

Israel Caminero: 14:38

So is this the same church or a different church?

Tabitha Yates: 14:41

Oh no, yes, no, it's many churches later. We're a military family, so I I moved quite a bit. So this was kind of my childhood church, and so I'm very far removed from it now.

Israel Caminero: 14:51

Okay, just making that clear. So, okay, so how did how did your experience with the church, both the hurt and obviously the eventual healing, shape your understanding of God's love for you?

Tabitha Yates: 15:07

Hmm. I think it shaped it in a negative way, so that I had to then really go through a process of separating Christ from Christianity and really naming the hurt, who inflicted hurt on me, how they did it, and really, you know, identifying each situation where wounding occurred, so then I could look at that situation and be like, where was God in that? Was that his heart? Is this what the Bible says God says about me? And I was able to break every situation down and see how God was not in that interaction whatsoever. He would that was not his heart, that was not biblical, what they were telling me was false, and I was able to then separate him so I could appropriately assign the blame and the hurt to the right people, so then I could walk through that process rather than because as a child that was all just reflected on God. That that became my belief of who Jesus was because that's what they're telling me he thought. And so it the biggest part um of recovering from church hurt for me was really identifying what was people and what was God, and who do I need to be forgiving and walking through this process of healing with. And it came down when it was all stripped to bare bones. Like I don't know who Jesus is at all because everything that has been shown of him to me is false. And so I had to do such a deep dive into the word of God and the character of God, just to be like, okay, this is how, and you know, that's why in my book I have a whole chapter about all the people in the Bible that kind of wrestled with, you know, emotional problems and mental health problems, because I wanted to look at what was God's response to every single one of these people. Did he respond with anger? Did he respond with impatience, or did he respond with kindness and grace and compassion? And so slowly looking at how God treated other people like me and people that were hurting and seeing how kind he was, that was the only thing that drew me back when I finally saw that everything I believed about him was false and that I was willing to let the word of God and the truth of who he was rebuild my and reshape my view of God and then the church subsequently after that.

Israel Caminero: 17:28

That's good. You know, sometimes people do get hurt and wounded by the church, but they fail to realize that the people that go to the church aren't God and they're the ones doing the hurting, you know.

Tabitha Yates: 17:43

Right. And I do think there's a very legitimate process, you know, that people need to walk through because I never want to bypass that wounding with someone. And I I talked to a lot of people about church hurt. I just did an interview yesterday that was solely about church hurt, because it is a very legitimate thing, and I don't think you can force yourself past it. Like if you don't truly walk through all the steps to heal, every church you walk in after, you're gonna immediately be seeing everything through that lens and looking for the hurt and looking for the offense. And again, it's a room full of imperfect people, so you're gonna find it really quickly if that's what you're going and looking for. And if you're going in looking for Jesus and looking for, okay, yes, what is the fruit in these people and using discernment? Is this a healthy body? Um, that's absolutely important. But if you haven't walked through that, that anger and bitterness, like that's that's still most of what you're gonna see. And so I was able to trust after I'd walked through so much healing and forgiveness and naming the abuse and naming the pain and then processing through it, I was able to trust that I now know who God is. So I'm not gonna walk into any church and not get a red flag if what they are presenting of Jesus is not the Jesus I know from the Bible and in my heart. And I now know who I am, who God says I am. So I'm not gonna walk into a building now and be told things and be prophesied things over me that are not God's heart for me and I know are not biblical. So I had to get much stronger in my faith and in my beliefs before I trusted that I'm not gonna be in this situation again because I have a discernment now where I know if I walk into a building and a body of believers that is not healthy, like I will see it and I will trust that discernment in me now.

Israel Caminero: 19:30

That's good, Tabitha. You also mentioned earlier that professional help helped you in your journey. So what I want to know is how did the professional help alongside with your relationship with Jesus you know, can you share how those two work together to bring you freedom?

Tabitha Yates: 19:55

Yeah, absolutely. Again, since I grew up in a church that was Was this was not allowed, you know. Again, it's it it took me getting to the point where I had attempted suicide before I was finally allowed to see a counselor. Um, I very much, you know, was raised with the mentality of this is not necessary, this is going to a source outside of Jesus, you don't need this, all you need is Jesus. And then there's the other side where, you know, so there's a side where people over-spiritualize it to such an extent that you don't have brokenness and real issues and trauma that you have to work through. But then simultaneously, there's people that immerse themselves in every self-help, every, you know, meditative, every everything you could possibly do on the world side of treating mental health, and it's not enough. Because if you don't have Jesus, you truly won't experience wholeness. You won't be walking in the purpose and what you were made for, and it will never be enough. And so for me, I had to realize that those two are not opposing, that they can go hand in hand, that God has equipped so many helpers and people that that are biblically sound, but they also understand neuroscience and they understand mental health conditions and they and they understand trauma care and that matters. When you've been deeply wounded and traumatized, you need to process and face those things. Your body remembers, your brain remembers, it just lives inside of you until you face it. And so for me, finally realizing that those things could come together in a marriage where where I didn't have to have one or the other, I didn't have to walk through this alone. All the painful healing and unraveling I had to do, God was gonna be there with me, in it with me. He cared intimately about my pain, but it still took action steps, it still took things that I had to do to face things, to feel things, to release things, to forgive things. And it it took both of those things. It again, so much complex trauma. I had been in therapy from the time I was 15, and I go still now because there's so much value in me being able to have a sounding board and me always having accountability. And anytime I feel something coming up, again, now that I'm a parent, I take triggers really seriously. I do have PTSD from all the abuse I experienced as a child. So when I recognize that something's coming up in me and an intense reaction is coming up in me, and it's spilling out over to my kids, that's my hard line where I'm like, nope, like time to go back and time to talk this out until I can have this not touch my children and not be something that I pass on to them and make their issue. So it is very much something that I have done hand in hand. I couldn't have healed and had the strength to keep facing it without my faith being my anchor, but I also could not have healed without having the guidance from trusted counselors and professionals and friends that poured into my life and helped me understand the trauma that I went through and the depression and the anxiety and the sources of it, and to walk through those so that they no longer controlled my life.

Israel Caminero: 23:12

So you mentioned that you still have triggers, correct? Well, I mean, obviously everyone still has triggers. So how are you today as far as your faith is is good? I can tell your faith is good. How is everything going today for Tabitha and in your household?

Tabitha Yates: 23:30

You know, I am so open about this because I still have panic attacks. I love to I love to start off when I'm having conversation with people of me being vulnerable first. And niece, I I always believed the lie that I wouldn't have a testimony until I'd come through the test. And in my mind, that meant I had conquered everything. I'd worked through everything. I this that never, you know, rears this ugly head again. And that's just simply not true. I have experienced so much hardship even through the process of writing this book. There was um opposition from people close to me that didn't want me to share the truth because anytime you bring abuse and hard things into the light, you know, the people who benefited from you being silent are not going to be happy about that. So I've had to walk through a third, fourth, fifth healing process, you know, writing the book in the seven months since it's been out from the things that I've faced. I very much still have to fight with anxiety. And it's amazing to me because my faith is unshakable. Like you could not tell me now that I don't pray enough and that I don't trust God because I have anxiety, because I know how hard I cling to Him. But I also recognize just as the aftermath of everything I have experienced in this life, that I'm gonna have some physical symptoms that I still have to face. And it's not, you know, it's not God failing me that I don't have this absolute complete deliverance and I've never had another panic attack again. It is just the natural consequence of some of you know the very hard things that I have been and sometimes still experienced. But I feel like God has given me so much clarity, so much peace, so much, you know, I I've been able to walk through most of my depression because I believe it was so circumstantial from being trapped in, you know, some really dark things for a really long time. You know, but I am honest with people, like, yeah, I still have I had a panic attack last week. Like I still face these things and I still face the reality of living in a broken world with a brain that was severely damaged as a child through all of my abuse, and it still hurts and things are still hard. But I have been able to let allow God to move in me and through me in a way that I still can pass on the lessons I've learned through all of these struggles I've been through, and I can still do good for him because he's good and he is faithful to use even the most broken, flawed people. And so I feel like I'm in a place where I have a lot of hope. I'm in a place where I have so much peace. I'm an I'm I love my kids. I'm so proud of the parent I became, even though I had no example in front of me of how to do that and how to be a healthy parent. I'm so proud that my all my kids love the Lord and have have him in their hearts, and that I've been able to carve out a completely different path. And I've been able to break really generational things. And so overall, I'm really proud and I'm really thankful, and I really just have an overwhelming amount of peace for where God has me right now.

Israel Caminero: 26:42

Yeah, it sounds like you have God as your first foundation, which is always good. Yeah, so you've mentioned your book and it's Jesus in therapy, right? Yep. You've mentioned it a few times, and can you reflect on what you hope readers take away from your book?

Tabitha Yates: 27:04

You know, one of the very first things that I wanted to do is I wanted to say what I would have said to me as a kid. All the things that I needed a Christian to say to me, that I needed a leader to say to me. I wanted to be the person to be that balm for wounded souls. And that's the first and foremost thing that I wanted this book to be, that someone just felt seen and known and loved by God after they read it, that they just felt like they had received a big hug and had been so validated in everything that they had been through. And I talked to hundreds and hundreds of people that have experienced so much wounding at the hands of the church, um, mostly because of their mental health issues not being understood properly. And so I really wanted to present a biblical and accurate understanding of mental health. I wanted to build a more compassionate church. I wanted us to understand how to love and show up for people who are struggling. I, you know, specifically address, you know, pastors and church leadership in the book, but also people who have loved ones that are struggling, and then just the people themselves that have been wounded and that are just barely hang hanging on to their faith, maybe because you've been so beat down and you just don't see how the two can go together and how you can keep on struggling the way you've been struggling, but still have this faith. And so I really just wanted to speak so much truth and hope and healing. And I always joke that there are no ABCs after my name. I don't have a professional licensing, but I think the lived experience breathes a lot of hope into people to see people who have been in such a dark place that they hated life and never wanted to wake up the next morning, and how God can bring that full circle to where they are now speaking that life into so many other people. And that's really what God did for me and what I knew He tasked me to do in this book is to just be a living beacon of hope for people that it can get better. Healing is hard, but it's worth it, and God will be faithful to walk you through the process if you keep on going and don't quit. And when we are faithless, he is faithful. And so I really just wanted someone to walk away feeling seen and feeling understood.

Israel Caminero: 29:24

Amen. Amen. And I'll have links to that book on the description of this podcast and anything else that she might want to share if anyone's interested to go and get the book and read it. I like to support everyone that's on here. We're almost coming to a close, Tabitha, but I have a few more questions. And I'll start with, you know, for someone listening right now who feels caught between their faith and their mental health, what encouragement would you want to speak into their life today?

Tabitha Yates: 29:54

Just know that God is for you and not against you, that your mental health is not a punishment from him, that he is present in your pain, and sometimes in those times where he seems the most distant is when he is doing the most work. And that there's nothing to be ashamed of of bringing in help. There are multiple verses in the Bible that discuss the benefits of wise counsel, and it is not contrary to your faith to receive counsel. So know that you can hold on to Jesus and still take the steps you need to to heal and address the hardships and trauma you've been through and take care of your mental health. Jesus had an absolutely whole health approach, and he takes care of us mind, body, soul, spirit. So I just want people to know that it is okay to go and find help, and you are not betraying your faith by doing so.

Israel Caminero: 30:52

That's right. That's right. God works through people, you know. So I know people that won't go to doctors or anything like that because they're like, no, God's gonna heal me, which which it's true. It's good to have faith like that, but God also works through professional help through them to help you too.

Tabitha Yates: 31:13

Right. And it's just that classic classic story of, you know, the man waiting for the for the boat or waiting for rescue when there's a flood and he gets to heaven and God sent him every practical means to save him. He's like, God, why didn't you save me? And there are people that God has put around us when the flood is rising, and we are allowed to call on those people, you know, and and it's I say the same thing about physical health, you know. If you're in the middle of having a heart attack, you're gonna be praying. Absolutely. But are you gonna not also call 911? Like you're gonna take the action step in the practical sense that you need to do to take care of your immediate health issue, and it's no different, and it shouldn't be any different.

Israel Caminero: 31:55

That's right. That's absolutely right. Thank you for that. Thank you for sharing that because I I I have friends that are like that that won't go to the hospital or anything like that, but like I said, you know, God works through people to help you. Yep. So you've gone through a lot of hardships and you're you're no longer going through those hardships right now or anything like that, praise God. I want to know, was there a life verse that you have, whether you were growing up or that you have to to this date, that when you're having a bad day, you can always go back to and read and what that life verse is and what it means to you?

Tabitha Yates: 32:43

I kind of have one that's been an anchor, it's a bit paraphrased, and then I have one now, and one of the ones that's carried me through and really speaks to what my faith is is in Daniel, where it it's you know, yes, God can save us, but it was Shadarch, Meshach, and Abend ago, but if not, he is still good. And just that idea that God has not taken me out of some really hard things. And for me to be able to declare the goodness of God after all the trauma I've been through, that is the level of faith and trust, the journey he took me on, to where even if to the natural eyes something is not good and it is not seeming to turn out in my favor, that I can still say, God, I know even if you do not save me from this specific situation or this specific pain, you're still good and you're still with me. And the verse that I love right now, so you know, so much because I feel like it's very much the way God is using me is 2 Corinthians 1, 4. And that's just that the father of compassion, God of all comfort, comforts us in all our troubles so that we can be a comfort to any trouble and that we can give that comfort to others. And I wouldn't have the empathy and the compassion and any wisdom if I hadn't walked through all this pain myself. And so the it's really that that vision of God brought me through the fire, and now he's sending me back with buckets of water for for other people, and that that I'm able to take the ways I've I've been comforted by him, and now I'm able to pass that on to other people and be like, no, this is how really how much God loves you. This is really what his heart is towards you and what he thinks about you, and I'm able to now pour that out onto others because God has been so gracious to give me that comfort throughout all the hardships in my life, and so that's a verse that I'm really living in right now.

Israel Caminero: 34:51

Amen, amen. And the first one was uh, I believe it was Daniel 316, I believe. Yes, yeah, so we're there in the fire, correct? Yes, all right. Yeah, definitely God could definitely save us. All we have to do is surrender. And God'll be right there. God's always there. It's just sometimes we're hard headed and don't want to seek him.

Tabitha Yates: 35:20

And just the idea that he's presence and it's it's it's that level of surrender in our hearts that I know you can, but even if you don't, I'm still gonna praise you and you're still good. And it's not you know blaming him for being in the fire, it's choosing to surrender to that process of refinement and trials and whatever it is that you're wishing God would take you out of, and maybe he's not.

Israel Caminero: 35:44

Right, that's right, because we're impatient, that's what it is. God does everything in his timing, not ours.

Tabitha Yates: 35:51

Yep.

Israel Caminero: 35:52

So sometimes people don't realize it. Sometimes it it happened and they're like, wow, it took that long, but hey, it happens.

Tabitha Yates: 36:01

Yeah, absolutely.

Israel Caminero: 36:03

But now I'm going to my back to the past section of the podcast. And what my back to the past section is, you touched on it earlier. If you can go back and talk to the younger Tabitha, what would you say to her that you didn't know then? This is something that you said that you wrote your book sort of around.

Tabitha Yates: 36:26

Right. Yeah. Um I would tell her that Jesus is not against you, that just wait and hold on to see everything that he's gonna bring through this, that he is kind and that he is for you, and that he is faithful, and what you're seeing of him right now is not you're not gonna be limited by that, that he's gonna reveal himself to you in ways that are so much more amazing, and you're gonna see that he wants fullness of life for you. And I would just tell her to hold on that it can get better and it will get better, and that I'll fight for her, and I'll fight for healing until she can finally take an easy breath in and feel at peace, and that one day her life is gonna be peaceful and she's gonna be okay and she's gonna be safe.

Israel Caminero: 37:30

Amen. Amen. That's good. Well, Tabitha, we're coming to a close, and I just want to say thank you for opening your heart and sharing your testimony today with everyone. I'm sure someone that's listening might be going through the same thing. But before we close, do you think you could pray us out?

Tabitha Yates: 37:53

No, absolutely. Heavenly Father, I thank you so much that you are a good father who gives good gifts to his children. I thank you that your love for us is endless, Lord, that you never leave or forsake us, and that in all of our trials, you're still working, you're still present, you're still loving, and you are still good. I pray that for the listener who might be experiencing deep hardship or pain or trauma or abuse, Lord, I pray that you would put your hand on them right now and that you would minister your peace to them and that you would speak words of healing and wholeness and life over them, Lord, that you would draw them out of the flood water and you would guide them to where they can find the help that they need, Lord, that you would just be a light and show them that way out of that dark tunnel, God. I thank you, God, that you are always before us, that there's never a situation, there's never a moment that we're gonna step into that you're not already there and you're not already waiting and you're present and available, God, that is always there for us, Lord. I pray that you would just bring comfort and hope and healing to all the hearts listening today in the name of Jesus. Amen.

Israel Caminero: 39:10

Amen. Amen. Thank you for that prayer and thank you for being here and taking the time to share your testimony, for courageously sharing your story with everyone today. You know, it's a powerful reminder that our brokenness is not too much for God, and that healing is found in him. You know, prayer community and yes, sometimes it's therapy and professional help. And I just want to say to all the listeners around the world, you know, I just want to thank you for always tuning in and support. And I also want to say testimony, encourage you to hold on to hope, to seek help when needed, and to remember that Jesus walked with you through every season of life. All glory goes to God for the work He continues to do in our lives. Until next time. Pressing forward, keep believing, and keep giving him glory. Because remember, it's her story, but it's all for his glory. Amen.